Monday, August 31, 2009

Put a Vulture on the DOJ Seal

When you release the terrorists and prosecute the good and faithful public servants at CIA, the seal is no longer worthy of an eagle -- but a vulture fits your character quite well.

11 comments:

bluepitbull said...

Pardon my swearing, but, no f___ing doubt!!

LSP said...

LL, I'm beginning to suspect you're a 'domestic terrorist'. Like the sniper picture.

God bless.

Opus #6 said...

LL, great post. Those vultures should be ashamed of themselves.

Opus #6 said...

On second thought, the DOJ guys give vultures a bad name.

LL said...

They are eating their own, Opus. In order to get to the CIA, they have to prosecute the DOJ people who wrote the opinions approving aggressive interrogations.

The world has taken a definite turn for the surreal.

Seda said...

This comes in kinda late. The vulture should have taken over way back when Yoo and Gonzales were turning the DOJ into a travesty of justice, effectiveness, and common sense.

You're right, though. The folks responsible for torture should be the ones prosecuted - not the lackeys who carried out the orders. Meanwhile, they walk free.

WoFat said...

Justice? No. Just us. the us being Barak H. Marx, et al.

LL said...

Seda- I know you have a different take on things than I do. I went through SERE training in the military, which meant that I was subjected to the same physical duress as those terrorists. Same rules, same waterboard, same BS. Nobody likes SERE training, but to equate that as "torture" in the sense that a Palestinian or Egyptian would manage a prisoner is completely different. There are no fingernails in an Egyptian prison. Go to Egypt, go to a prison and see for yourself.

The people such as KSM, who were selected for aggressive interrogation were the very worst of the worst who were actively planning to attack defenseless citizens in the US. And to spite what the morons back home in the US believe, the interrogation practices worked. And we have been safe for 8 years partly because of that program.

Obama, viewed essentially as an "empty suit" everywhere in the world but here, does us no favors by de-fanging the US.

Seda said...

LL,
I object to torture on primarily two grounds:

First, as a practical matter, it is ineffective. It cannot produce reliable evidence or testimony, as witnessed by the fact that information obtained under torture cannot be used in a court of law. Waterboarding most certainly IS torture - the intent is to cause such intense suffering that the subject is compelled to reveal secrets and testify against himself. If you have indeed suffered waterboarding, you know that either it did not cause sufficient discomfort to force you to reveal anything you didn't want to reveal, or that you would say anything that you believed would make it stop. In either case, it is unreliable.

My second objection is the greater. Torture completely abdicates all moral and ethical high ground, and willingly embraces the embodiment of evil. It is the intentional commission of acute pain or suffering against one who is helpless to resist. It is an act of supreme weakness and cowardice. It damages the body of the tortured, but the soul of the torturer. It is bad karma. The torture ordered and/or enabled by G.W. Bush, Cheney, et al has disgraced and damaged our nation - and, if anything, has further endangered us.

The idea that torture can keep us safe is a myth, and a sad, bitter one at that. We would do much better to light a beacon on a hill, not wade into the depths of depravity to join the worst of our enemies.

LL said...

There is a difference between aggressive interrogation and torture and the definition seems to be quite subjective.

The goal with aggressive interrogation is not to get information to be used in court. It is all about obtaining information that can be used to prevent an attack.

I personally disagree with torture, which would include electrocution, breaking bones, teeth, extracting fingernails, cutting eyelids, blinding and mutilation.

Seda said...

'nuff said. I believe our positions are clear. Be blessed.

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